• Test team of the 90s

    From Hamish Laws@24:150/2 to rec.sport.cricket on Sun Nov 22 21:34:39 2020
    Here's a team picked by a couple of the Wisden people and Graham Thorpe

    https://wisden.com/stories/1990s-in-review/wisdens-test-team-of-the-1990s?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR15HqjauCX5qWN0Gsa3-ElGVQvAdXIt1vFERaVh8ueHrFPAf8mtLzn1cf0#Echobox=1606058278

    what do people think about it?
    --- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
    * Origin: SportNet Gateway Site (24:150/2)
  • From alvey@24:150/2 to rec.sport.cricket on Mon Nov 23 16:04:40 2020
    On Sun, 22 Nov 2020 21:34:39 -0800 (PST), Hamish Laws wrote:

    Here's a team picked by a couple of the Wisden people and Graham Thorpe

    https://wisden.com/stories/1990s-in-review/wisdens-test-team-of-the-1990s?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR15HqjauCX5qWN0Gsa3-ElGVQvAdXIt1vFERaVh8ueHrFPAf8mtLzn1cf0#Echobox=1606058278

    what do people think about it?

    Not a lot. To paraphrase, "Best of Teams are like arseholes..."


    alvey
    --- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
    * Origin: SportNet Gateway Site (24:150/2)
  • From John Hall@24:150/2 to rec.sport.cricket on Mon Nov 23 10:39:33 2020
    In message <b523074d-93c8-4cd5-bd74-608c875b4eb6n@googlegroups.com>,
    Hamish Laws <hamish.laws@gmail.com> writes
    Here's a team picked by a couple of the Wisden people and Graham Thorpe

    https://wisden.com/stories/1990s-in-review/wisdens-test-team-of-the-1990 >s?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR15HqjauCX5qWN0Gsa3-El >GVQvAdXIt1vFERaVh8ueHrFPAf8mtLzn1cf0#Echobox=1606058278

    what do people think about it?

    It's obviously a pretty good side. The most difficult thing for me is remembering candidates' years for their Test careers and when they were
    at their peak.

    Though I was a big fan of Stewart, he's perhaps slightly fortunate to be chosen ahead of, say, Haydon. I wonder if the absence of any English
    players if he wasn't chosen was a factor. And I nearly forgot about
    Gooch! Was it a bit early for Dravid? Otherwise he'd come in for de
    Silva. (Though they may have tried to pick players from as many
    countries as possible. Of the Test countries at that time, only NZ and Zimbabwe lack a representative in their side.)

    You could make a case for Jack Russell instead of Healy as keeper. Was
    it a bit too early to have Gilchrist at his peak? What about Andy
    Flower?

    I was wondering about having either Glenn McGrath or Waqar Younis
    instead of Pollock. There's no finger-spinner should the pitch require
    one, but I don't recall any from that period other than Murali who might demand inclusion.
    --
    John Hall "Hard work often pays off after time, but laziness always
    pays off now." Anon
    --- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
    * Origin: SportNet Gateway Site (24:150/2)
  • From Hamish Laws@24:150/2 to rec.sport.cricket on Mon Nov 23 04:30:06 2020
    On Monday, November 23, 2020 at 9:41:23 PM UTC+11, John Hall wrote:
    In message <b523074d-93c8-4cd5...@googlegroups.com>,
    Hamish Laws <hamis...@gmail.com> writes
    Here's a team picked by a couple of the Wisden people and Graham Thorpe

    https://wisden.com/stories/1990s-in-review/wisdens-test-team-of-the-1990 >s?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR15HqjauCX5qWN0Gsa3-El >GVQvAdXIt1vFERaVh8ueHrFPAf8mtLzn1cf0#Echobox=1606058278

    what do people think about it?
    It's obviously a pretty good side. The most difficult thing for me is remembering candidates' years for their Test careers and when they were
    at their peak.

    Though I was a big fan of Stewart, he's perhaps slightly fortunate to be chosen ahead of, say, Haydon.

    Hayden's record in the 90s was pretty disappointing , he played 7 tests with 1 100 iirc
    Slater would probably have been the Australian opener in contention, but his meltdown started in the 90s iirc

    I wonder if the absence of any English
    players if he wasn't chosen was a factor. And I nearly forgot about
    Gooch!

    Worth considering, his best play was probably in the early 90s and he fell away badly in his last couple of series but he still averaged over 51 for the decade

    Was it a bit early for Dravid?

    Debut in 96, 6 100s in the decade

    Otherwise he'd come in for de
    Silva. (Though they may have tried to pick players from as many
    countries as possible. Of the Test countries at that time, only NZ and Zimbabwe lack a representative in their side.)

    You could make a case for Jack Russell instead of Healy as keeper. Was
    it a bit too early to have Gilchrist at his peak?

    Didn't debut in tests until the 99/00 season

    What about Andy Flower?

    has a case, not sure that his keeping was that good but I haven't seen a lot of him

    I was wondering about having either Glenn McGrath or Waqar Younis
    instead of Pollock.

    I'd be tempted to, I always got the impression that McGrath was a bit more incisive as a bowler than Pollock
    Saying that a lot of the difference is probably down to Pollock's relative lack of success against Australia (av 36, sr 80+) which McGrath didn't have to bowl to

    OTOH there's no question that Pollock was a lot better batsman

    There's no finger-spinner should the pitch require
    one, but I don't recall any from that period other than Murali who might demand inclusion.

    Nobody else really screams out to me, Tim May had a few good matches but overall was nothing special
    --- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
    * Origin: SportNet Gateway Site (24:150/2)
  • From Ramapriya D@24:150/2 to rec.sport.cricket on Mon Nov 23 19:15:07 2020
    On Monday, November 23, 2020 at 9:34:41 AM UTC+4, Hamish Laws wrote:
    Here's a team picked by a couple of the Wisden people and Graham Thorpe

    https://wisden.com/stories/1990s-in-review/wisdens-test-team-of-the-1990s?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR15HqjauCX5qWN0Gsa3-ElGVQvAdXIt1vFERaVh8ueHrFPAf8mtLzn1cf0#Echobox=1606058278

    what do people think about it?
    Stats aren't everything and all that, yes, but as a frontline batter you average under 40 in 8 of the 10 countries you play in, you shouldn't be in a team of the decade unless the other choices are all rotten. As a much more dependable batter with a CV that only has a bouncy pitch hole, I'd have picked Inzamam over de Silva in the middle-order and pushed S Waugh one position lower. Thorpe himself was a very decent middle-order batter and well worth a look-in.
    I also would've chosen Donald since he was a lot better in the 90s wherever he played. Pollock would anyway have been #4 in my list behind McGrath and Waqar.
    Although his average fell away when with the mitts, I'd have Andy Flower 'keep and open instead of Stewart, and pick Mark Waugh, who scored lots of very graceful runs in the lower middle-order, instead of Healy. Whether these would (a) reduce Warne's efficacy and (b) have one batsman too many are arguable.
    --- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
    * Origin: SportNet Gateway Site (24:150/2)
  • From Hamish Laws@24:150/2 to rec.sport.cricket on Tue Nov 24 06:21:03 2020
    On Tuesday, November 24, 2020 at 2:15:09 PM UTC+11, Ramapriya D wrote:
    On Monday, November 23, 2020 at 9:34:41 AM UTC+4, Hamish Laws wrote:
    Here's a team picked by a couple of the Wisden people and Graham Thorpe

    https://wisden.com/stories/1990s-in-review/wisdens-test-team-of-the-1990s?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR15HqjauCX5qWN0Gsa3-ElGVQvAdXIt1vFERaVh8ueHrFPAf8mtLzn1cf0#Echobox=1606058278

    what do people think about it?
    Stats aren't everything and all that, yes, but as a frontline batter you average under 40 in 8 of the 10 countries you play in, you shouldn't be in a team of the decade unless the other choices are all rotten. As a much more dependable batter with a CV that only has a bouncy pitch hole, I'd have picked Inzamam over de Silva in the middle-order and pushed S Waugh one position lower. Thorpe himself was a very decent middle-order batter and well worth a look-in.

    I also would've chosen Donald since he was a lot better in the 90s wherever he played. Pollock would anyway have been #4 in my list behind McGrath and Waqar.
    Dunno, Donald, Amrose and Akram as the 3 quicks is all strike bowlers.

    Although his average fell away when with the mitts, I'd have Andy Flower 'keep and open
    Flower actually averages higher as a keeper than not as a keeper
    But he never opened the batting, he averaged 16 at #3 and 27 at 4 so I don't see picking him as an opener as a real option even apart from the dubiousness of having somebody keep and open.
    instead of Stewart, and pick Mark Waugh, who scored lots of very graceful runs in the lower middle-order, instead of Healy. Whether these would (a) reduce Warne's efficacy and (b) have one batsman too many are arguable.
    --- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
    * Origin: SportNet Gateway Site (24:150/2)
  • From Dechucka@24:150/2 to rec.sport.cricket on Wed Nov 25 06:59:12 2020
    On 23/11/2020 4:34 pm, Hamish Laws wrote:
    Here's a team picked by a couple of the Wisden people and Graham Thorpe

    https://wisden.com/stories/1990s-in-review/wisdens-test-team-of-the-1990s?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR15HqjauCX5qWN0Gsa3-ElGVQvAdXIt1vFERaVh8ueHrFPAf8mtLzn1cf0#Echobox=1606058278

    what do people think about it?



    An excellent team but is is so hard to pick the best. Is this the best
    team for every country and and all conditions?
    --- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
    * Origin: SportNet Gateway Site (24:150/2)
  • From John Hall@24:150/2 to rec.sport.cricket on Tue Nov 24 20:52:31 2020
    In message <4ZGdnTPDkLqM-yDCnZ2dnUU7-NmdnZ2d@westnet.com.au>, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com> writes
    On 23/11/2020 4:34 pm, Hamish Laws wrote:
    Here's a team picked by a couple of the Wisden people and Graham Thorpe

    https://wisden.com/stories/1990s-in-review/wisdens-test-team-of-the-199 >>0s?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR15HqjauCX5qWN0Gsa3- >>ElGVQvAdXIt1vFERaVh8ueHrFPAf8mtLzn1cf0#Echobox=1606058278
    what do people think about it?



    An excellent team but is is so hard to pick the best. Is this the best
    team for every country and and all conditions?

    Every "best XI" has to be a compromise on that score, I think. For
    instance on a "traditional" Indian pitch you'd want a second spinner in
    place of one of the quicks.
    --
    John Hall "Hard work often pays off after time, but laziness always
    pays off now." Anon
    --- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
    * Origin: SportNet Gateway Site (24:150/2)
  • From Dechucka@24:150/2 to rec.sport.cricket on Wed Nov 25 08:24:43 2020
    On 25/11/2020 7:52 am, John Hall wrote:
    In message <4ZGdnTPDkLqM-yDCnZ2dnUU7-NmdnZ2d@westnet.com.au>, Dechucka <Dechucka1@hotmail.com> writes
    On 23/11/2020 4:34 pm, Hamish Laws wrote:
    Here's a team picked by a couple of the Wisden people and Graham Thorpe

    https://wisden.com/stories/1990s-in-review/wisdens-test-team-of-the-199
    0s?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR15HqjauCX5qWN0Gsa3-
    ElGVQvAdXIt1vFERaVh8ueHrFPAf8mtLzn1cf0#Echobox=1606058278
    -awhat do people think about it?



    An excellent team but is is so hard to pick the best. Is this the best
    team for every country and and all conditions?

    Every "best XI" has to be a compromise on that score, I think.

    Agree but it is an interesting exercise

    For
    instance on a "traditional" Indian pitch you'd want a second spinner in place of one of the quicks.

    Same for an old Sydney pitch
    --- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
    * Origin: SportNet Gateway Site (24:150/2)